How to Create a Lifestyle of Discipleship
Is discipleship about gaining knowledge, or is it about a transformed life? Is it a series of classes or, like with Jesus and his pals, was it an all-of-life kind of a deal?
In this episode of the Everyday Disciple Podcast, we’re talking about true discipleship and looking at what a lifestyle of discipleship looks like when it is all woven into the normal rhythms of your everyday life in community.
In This Episode You’ll Learn:
- A working definition of discipleship that will reshape your thinking on this immediately
- How Jesus lived life with his disciples and what he then hoped/commanded them to do
- Why a series of 8-10 classes done in a classroom will never produce mature disciples
- Why an integrated lifestyle “apprenticeship” was Jesus’ model for us
Each week the Big 3 will give you immediate action steps to get you started.
Download today’s BIG 3 right now. Read and think over them again later. You might even want to share them with others…
Thanks for Listening!
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Links and Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
Coaching with Caesar and Tina in discipleship and missional living.
Discipleship and Missional Resources
Transcript
What I have found from speaking in training all over the world and getting a zillion emails is that the average Christian is looking to move their faith from just a weekly Sunday event.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yep.
Caesar Kalinowski:They're not trying to chuck that, but you know, here the whole thing here, don't tune out yet.
Caesar Kalinowski:They're looking to move their faith from just having a weekly Sunday event to a daily, vibrant experience in the normal rhythms of everyday life.
Caesar Kalinowski:Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:They're searching for a more auth.
Caesar Kalinowski:Authentic, maybe even supernatural lifestyle with their faith lived out with family and close friends.
Caesar Kalinowski:And that's a good thing that, that people are starting to desire that that's not an, that's not a bang on the church or Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:Like, oh man, church services suck or whatever.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's like, no, it's not that at all what they're desiring.
Caesar Kalinowski:God actually created him for that and it's good because that's how discipleship, true biblical discipleship actually happens as a lifestyle in the normal rhythms of life with others.
Heath Hollensbe:Welcome to the Everyday Disciple Podcast, where you'll learn how to live with greater intentionality and an integrated faith that naturally fits into every area of.
Heath Hollensbe:Life.
Heath Hollensbe:In other words, discipleship as a lifestyle.
Heath Hollensbe:This is the stuff your parents, pastors and seminary professors probably forgot to tell you.
Heath Hollensbe:And now here's your host.
Heath Hollensbe:Caesar.
Heath Hollensbe:Kalinowski.
Caesar Kalinowski:Okay.
Caesar Kalinowski:Alrighty.
Caesar Kalinowski:Good to be back.
Caesar Kalinowski:Feeling really good.
Caesar Kalinowski:Tina and I just got back from a little vacation to Hawaii.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's my favorite place lately for just relaxing.
Caesar Kalinowski:I've even all over the world, been very fortunate in that sense.
Caesar Kalinowski:But when I really want to just ha relax my heart, now we go to Hawaii and we got to do that for a week and it was wonderful.
Caesar Kalinowski:We took our oldest grandson, Patton along with us, and we've been waiting years for these types of experience.
Caesar Kalinowski:When the babies are born, you're like, man, someday we're gonna take you to Hawaii.
Caesar Kalinowski:So last week was the time he was old enough to do that kind of traveling without his parents.
Caesar Kalinowski:This is actually a second trip with us to these kinds of things.
Caesar Kalinowski:Anyway, He's like the best traveler though.
Caesar Kalinowski:I used to be a missions pastor and I would have to drag a whole lot of folks from the church around the world on missions trips, sometimes 20, 25, I don't know, maybe more at a time.
Caesar Kalinowski:And it was just a constant series of people losing things, losing their backpack, losing luggage, losing their passports.
Caesar Kalinowski:One time we lost a person.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah, it happens, right?
Caesar Kalinowski:And you just get, ugh, you get so frustrated that Patton is six years old and he's like a rockstar traveler.
Caesar Kalinowski:He's got all of his stuff together.
Caesar Kalinowski:Whenever you know it's time to leave, wait, he's already ready.
Caesar Kalinowski:He's got everything outta the backpack.
Caesar Kalinowski:He's double check out of the back seat pack.
Caesar Kalinowski:I mean, he's double checked.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's on his backpack.
Caesar Kalinowski:He carries his backpack, he pulls his own roller board, like full adult size.
Caesar Kalinowski:I would take that kid anywhere and we had such a good time with him, man.
Caesar Kalinowski:Lots of exploring, lots of fun, and he had never seen Hawaii, so I loved it and he loved it.
Caesar Kalinowski:So anyway, feeling pretty good this week.
Caesar Kalinowski:Hey, I wanna read a review that came in recently on Apple, uh, podcasts.
Caesar Kalinowski:I think that's what they're calling it now.
Caesar Kalinowski:And this one's from, if I'm saying this, even close to right, you know, little handle names in there, casinos.
Caesar Kalinowski:So, thank you.
Caesar Kalinowski:It says, uh, leading from unbelief to belief.
Caesar Kalinowski:Exclamation, uh, love your work here, brother.
Caesar Kalinowski:Your motto of leading from unbelief to belief and what he's referring to is, is, uh, Discipleship, right, is the process of leading people to move from unbelief to belief.
Caesar Kalinowski:We're gonna talk a whole lot about that today.
Caesar Kalinowski:He says, it's so beautiful and it resonates with me.
Caesar Kalinowski:Thank you for your faithfulness to God and his call in your life.
Caesar Kalinowski:Hey, you're really welcome, brother and or sister, I don't know, casinos.
Caesar Kalinowski:And, uh, grateful for that.
Caesar Kalinowski:I hope that encourages others to also subscribe.
Caesar Kalinowski:And leave reviews wherever you can, depending on what platform you're listening.
Caesar Kalinowski:If you're listening on an Apple device, which is most people in the world when it comes to podcast, then you can do that.
Caesar Kalinowski:And I, I really wish you would if you've enjoyed the podcast and it's free, so pay it forward and encourage us by just leaving a review like, That.
Caesar Kalinowski:All right.
Caesar Kalinowski:And if you need to, uh, find out where, you know, like I've been listening on your website, where, where else can I go?
Caesar Kalinowski:There are so many platforms out there for podcasts.
Caesar Kalinowski:We're on all of them, and you can go to everyday Disciple dot com slash listen to get a whole list of them and links right to them.
Caesar Kalinowski:That'll work on all kinds of devices.
Caesar Kalinowski:All right, and I also want to.
Caesar Kalinowski:Invite you to join me over at the Facebook page, the Everyday Disciple Podcast.
Caesar Kalinowski:We have our own group, over 5,000 people now, and you can, uh, always be updated on what's going on, new episodes, training free resources, ask questions, uh, just be a community.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's awesome.
Caesar Kalinowski:Join us over there.
Caesar Kalinowski:Just go to everyday Disciple dot com slash facebook.
Caesar Kalinowski:It'll take you right there, or you can just search for it on Facebook.
Caesar Kalinowski:Just look it up and you'll find it real easily.
Caesar Kalinowski:We'd love to have you.
Caesar Kalinowski:All right, Heath, let's get her started.
Heath Hollensbe:Today we're gonna get into discipleship pretty heavy.
Heath Hollensbe:It's kind of the crux of what we talk
Caesar Kalinowski:about here on podcast.
Caesar Kalinowski:All of life really is discipleship and the way I see it.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah, yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:And and it's
Heath Hollensbe:not necessarily a series of classes inside the church building before the service starts that has like a list of topics that need to be covered.
Heath Hollensbe:Yeah.
Heath Hollensbe:It's not Sunday school, but I think what we're gonna head towards is you unpacking what it looks like to actually have a lifestyle where discipleship is woven and and fixed into the normal rhythms of our.
Heath Hollensbe:Life and then the
Caesar Kalinowski:normal rhythms of our community.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's what I wanna talk about because it, it feels like, you know, Disciple show, like you said, it's not a series of classes.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's not, I mean, I guess it could be reduced to that, but that doesn't really get the job done.
Caesar Kalinowski:Um, but um, the reality is, is when it truly is woven into the normal rhythm of his life Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Becomes the lifestyle.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's what we're looking for.
Caesar Kalinowski:Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:And it's not like something to be added on.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's not additional.
Caesar Kalinowski:You just, you live it.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yep.
Caesar Kalinowski:And that's, I think that's what we're all looking for.
Caesar Kalinowski:Absolutely.
Caesar Kalinowski:So hopefully today will be, Uh, help with that for a lot of people.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:So,
Heath Hollensbe:okay.
Heath Hollensbe:When we start right here at the very beginning, let's start by defining discipleship.
Heath Hollensbe:I know that you've given us cool, concise definition of this before in other episodes, but for those who are just tuning in, first time
Caesar Kalinowski:discipleship.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Okay.
Caesar Kalinowski:So here's, here's how I define discipleship.
Caesar Kalinowski:Boom.
Caesar Kalinowski:Short discipleship is the process of moving from unbelief to belief in absolutely every area of life.
Caesar Kalinowski:So I'll put a little more meat on that.
Caesar Kalinowski:Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's the process, discipleship's the process of moving from unbelief about what's true about God and what he's done and what's now true of us.
Caesar Kalinowski:So how we get to live, right?
Caesar Kalinowski:But in every area of life, we're moving from unbelief to belief.
Caesar Kalinowski:Some people call that sanctification.
Caesar Kalinowski:I think those are kind of interchangeable words in that sense.
Caesar Kalinowski:Okay.
Caesar Kalinowski:Um, but yeah, that's, and that's it.
Caesar Kalinowski:See, discipleship isn't head knowledge.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's not acquisition of.
Caesar Kalinowski:A ton of Bible verses.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Or like if you read through the whole Bible like three times and you, you know, you do a study in Romans at a men's group.
Caesar Kalinowski:I guess I'm discipled.
Caesar Kalinowski:I don't, you know.
Caesar Kalinowski:Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:Discipleship is the process of moving from unbelief to belief.
Caesar Kalinowski:In absolutely every area of life.
Caesar Kalinowski:Mm-hmm.
Caesar Kalinowski:And I think that's a lifelong journey because um, you know, you hang out with me enough to know I'm not exactly like Jesus in every area of my life.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, and my thought, and you know, deed and language and alt right, it's like sure, like we're all in process, but we're in the process of moving from unbelief to belief.
Caesar Kalinowski:And the reason I say that is cuz the Bible teaches really clearly that all sin.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:There's things that aren't like God, don't please him.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right.
Caesar Kalinowski:Separate us from God are all connected to our unbelief.
Caesar Kalinowski:About what's true of him.
Caesar Kalinowski:Hmm.
Caesar Kalinowski:And or our, our restored identity.
Caesar Kalinowski:So discipleship then again, is the process of moving from unbelief to belief in every area of life, not just in the belief about our atonement, you know, and someday, we'll, you know, be sure Christ forever in heaven.
Caesar Kalinowski:But, but in like, what about our parenting?
Caesar Kalinowski:What about.
Caesar Kalinowski:Our marriage.
Caesar Kalinowski:What about our budget?
Caesar Kalinowski:What about how we spend our time on our vacation, our generosity?
Caesar Kalinowski:What about our attitude?
Caesar Kalinowski:What about literally
Heath Hollensbe:how we tip literally every area?
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah, exactly right.
Caesar Kalinowski:So that's, that's what I'm talking about.
Caesar Kalinowski:A lifestyle now of discipleship would be a lifestyle where we.
Caesar Kalinowski:And I'm gonna make the case for why it has to be with others.
Caesar Kalinowski:Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:Um, where we are in the process of ourselves and helping others move from unbelief to belief in every area of God.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:So the
Heath Hollensbe:distinction is, uh, when I was a kid, raised in a little Wesleyan church in Southern California.
Heath Hollensbe:Um, way to go.
Heath Hollensbe:Yeah, they did.
Heath Hollensbe:They tried.
Heath Hollensbe:But one of the things that you just said that was super helpful is my discipleship, uh, unspoken was the information, it was a transformation of knowledge.
Heath Hollensbe:It was.
Heath Hollensbe:Bible study.
Heath Hollensbe:It was Wednesday night, uh, AWANA's or, or whatever it was that they tried to get us to, but there was no interest.
Heath Hollensbe:Did you crush the
Caesar Kalinowski:AWANA's stuff?
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah, the uh, sword drills.
Caesar Kalinowski:You ever Yeah, I did that.
Caesar Kalinowski:I
Heath Hollensbe:was king.
Heath Hollensbe:Eighth grade winner in my school.
Heath Hollensbe:Sword drill.
Heath Hollensbe:Yeah, I was fast,
Caesar Kalinowski:man.
Caesar Kalinowski:I'm gonna think of some good questions maybe for another episode.
Caesar Kalinowski:Do some, they scared to me sword drilling for you,
Heath Hollensbe:but, um, so discipleship, what we're saying is it's not that, that acquisition.
Heath Hollensbe:Of information that is downloaded by us studying harder or longer
Caesar Kalinowski:on a specific and then go try harder to change your behavior Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Or something.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Heath Hollensbe:Hoping it just naturally will catch up to you.
Heath Hollensbe:So if it's not this series of classes or 10 topics to be covered, because I didn't even get that growing up.
Heath Hollensbe:If people are not getting that, then what is, uh, Sunday morning's purpose, is it ever gonna get the job
Caesar Kalinowski:done?
Caesar Kalinowski:Well, I don't, I mean, I'm all about getting together on Sunday and I love preaching.
Caesar Kalinowski:I'm a preacher, right.
Caesar Kalinowski:I love it.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:But no, I, it will not get it done alone.
Caesar Kalinowski:It, it can be a part of it because you know, the renewing of our minds, right?
Caesar Kalinowski:Learning things is part of that, but it will never get to the point of.
Caesar Kalinowski:Making mature disciples in every area of life because sitting there in silence, you don't get to address every area of life.
Caesar Kalinowski:And then someone gets to walk and watch and Yeah, speak into it.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right.
Caesar Kalinowski:And you know what I have found from speaking and training all over the world and getting a zillion emails, is that the average Christian I.
Caesar Kalinowski:Is looking to move their faith from just a weekly Sunday event.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yep.
Caesar Kalinowski:They're not trying to chuck that, but they're, you know, here the whole thing here, don't tune out you.
Caesar Kalinowski:They're, they're, they're looking to move their faith from just having a weekly Sunday event to a daily, vibrant experience in the normal rhythms of everyday life.
Caesar Kalinowski:Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:They're searching for a more authentic, maybe even supernatural lifestyle.
Caesar Kalinowski:With their faith, lived out with family and close friends.
Caesar Kalinowski:And that's a good thing that, that people are starting to desire that that's not an, that's not a bang on the church or Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:Like, oh man, church services suck or whatever.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's like, no, it's not that at all what they're desiring.
Caesar Kalinowski:God actually created him for that.
Caesar Kalinowski:And it's good because that's how discipleship, true biblical discipleship actually happens as a lifestyle in the normal rhythms of life with others.
Caesar Kalinowski:And let, let me just say why it has to be that way.
Caesar Kalinowski:Like you'll never, you'll never get to full.
Caesar Kalinowski:I don't believe you'll get to full maturity.
Caesar Kalinowski:With just learning stuff.
Caesar Kalinowski:Okay.
Caesar Kalinowski:And self-study or even on a one-to-one because no one's Jesus alone.
Caesar Kalinowski:Okay, sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:So for one, they'll just say that you, you can't one-to-one Disciple somebody to maturity because you are not Jesus.
Caesar Kalinowski:You have unbelief in your life.
Caesar Kalinowski:You've got areas, and you might be able to help me with certain things, and that might be an aspect of it, but I think it.
Caesar Kalinowski:It takes these three things.
Caesar Kalinowski:It takes the Gospel in community lived together on mission to make a mature Disciple.
Caesar Kalinowski:Here's why.
Caesar Kalinowski:The Gospel is what sets us free.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's what transforms us.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's what we're moving from unbelief in the Gospel to belief in the Gospel in every area of life.
Caesar Kalinowski:So it's gotta be Gospel centered.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yep.
Caesar Kalinowski:Not knowledge centered.
Caesar Kalinowski:Bible literacy isn't Bible fluency.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right?
Caesar Kalinowski:Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:We talked about that.
Caesar Kalinowski:Has to be done in community because that's when we get rubbed on.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's when my preferences and my likes and dislikes and sin comes out.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:And, and you know, sitting on the couch watching tv, no one gets to see me sin.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Or what my thought life is or what.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right.
Caesar Kalinowski:But in community, That's when it comes out and I need someone to speak the truth back to me.
Caesar Kalinowski:Remind me of my own belief, or show me my own belief and help me move to belief.
Caesar Kalinowski:And then on mission, because it's, it's that outward expression.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's that moving out mission, by the way, is discipleship, but it's the outward movement towards those who are not yet in the family.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, they're not yet living with dad and, and his kids.
Caesar Kalinowski:And it's when we start to.
Caesar Kalinowski:Sort of serve the least of these and give our life and our preferences and reorient our life around their life and needs that they're, again, a lot of our unbelief surfaces.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, my unbelief doesn't surface, you know, with a bowl of popcorn sit on my lap and a cold beverage and the remote in my hand.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's when I'm out.
Caesar Kalinowski:With people who don't necessarily agree with me or see the world the way I do.
Caesar Kalinowski:Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:Or when I'm serving 'em and they're not that thankful or they're smelly or dirty or weird or have a different worldview, or they hate my worldview, that's when my own unbelief and sanctification needs sort of show up.
Caesar Kalinowski:So it takes the Gospel in community on mission to actually, I think, make 'em mature.
Caesar Kalinowski:Disciple, which
Heath Hollensbe:sounds opposite almost, almost exactly opposite of everything that we're currently used to.
Heath Hollensbe:So you got the Gospel.
Heath Hollensbe:Not necessarily a big community, typically even the phrase, but in a small group, closed off group of the same people that kind of meet all the time where we get together and study the Bible, but we don't really know how to apply it to each other's life.
Heath Hollensbe:And so like we've talked before, I can show up on Sundays and even Wednesday night and I can fool people for a really long time and for years I have.
Heath Hollensbe:Oh yeah.
Heath Hollensbe:But it's when.
Heath Hollensbe:We're actually in community and people are in my house going, dude, I'm noticing a pattern of the way you're so short with your wife or Exactly.
Heath Hollensbe:Your kids are coming up to you and it takes them like, you know, you're, you're, you're harsh with them what's going on there and that's when Yeah.
Heath Hollensbe:That's when you're able to Gospel some
Caesar Kalinowski:unbelief.
Caesar Kalinowski:Exactly.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Now some of some folks are listening right now going like, Hey, exactly why I don't do community.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's true.
Caesar Kalinowski:So, you know, preface, sanctification, preface here, this is God's desire and design for us, but it might not be ours all the time.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know?
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Just being honest.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right?
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Um, and that was the biggest leap for me is that hurdle of
Heath Hollensbe:initially
Caesar Kalinowski:diving here, but it really has to happen in a Gospel centered community living together on mission.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's, that's, that's sort of the.
Caesar Kalinowski:Primary organizing structure.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's the bed that discipleship happens in.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's not gonna happen in a classroom alone or listening to sermons alone.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's just, it won't.
Caesar Kalinowski:If it could've, Jesus would've done it that differently.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:He did it that way.
Heath Hollensbe:Yeah.
Heath Hollensbe:So this sounds probably new to people.
Heath Hollensbe:It sounds super exciting and elusive, but it also sounds super rare because there's not too many people that I know that have really even ever experienced discipleship.
Heath Hollensbe:I know.
Heath Hollensbe:I'm one of those.
Heath Hollensbe:Even in their Christian faith in this sort of manner or this depth.
Heath Hollensbe:And so most Christians that I know are typically stuck in this loop of Sunday to Sunday.
Heath Hollensbe:We'll see you next week.
Heath Hollensbe:And that's all the ask
Caesar Kalinowski:we have of people.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right.
Caesar Kalinowski:And I don't, I don't even think most Christians go to church services mean
Caesar Kalinowski:every
Heath Hollensbe:week anymore.
Heath Hollensbe:Right?
Heath Hollensbe:Yeah.
Heath Hollensbe:No, I think 1.7 times a month, uh, or 2.3 times.
Heath Hollensbe:Like, it's like the national average,
Caesar Kalinowski:it's weeks a month.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:For the committed Christians.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Heath Hollensbe:For members.
Heath Hollensbe:Yeah.
Heath Hollensbe:So, um, What are your thoughts on this?
Heath Hollensbe:Is that, that on that loop of Sunday to Sunday
Caesar Kalinowski:and, well, I think you're right.
Caesar Kalinowski:I think, I think that's what we're taught and I think that's kinda what we get stuck in that.
Caesar Kalinowski:And um, I wanna tell you a little bit of my own story coming up here in a minute, but, you know, the only people I've seen consistently end this cycle and breakthrough to live one, like integrated life versus living like my real life over here and then fitting their Christian life Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:And service and all that stuff.
Caesar Kalinowski:Uh, in over here are those that have experienced a pretty rare but very real.
Caesar Kalinowski:Lifestyle apprenticeship.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's what I wanna call it.
Caesar Kalinowski:Like you can't study your way in books to this.
Caesar Kalinowski:You can't sit in enough sermons or conferences or seminars to get this.
Caesar Kalinowski:The people I know that have broken that cycle, I'm not saying they won't go to church, I'm saying, but they've broken that.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's it.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's their kind of level of spirituality and experience of it.
Caesar Kalinowski:But for themselves and their family, the ones I know that have actually done this, where they have an integrated life, have experienced literally a lifestyle apprenticeship form of discipleship.
Caesar Kalinowski:It was, it was about all of life.
Caesar Kalinowski:And it was, like I said already, it has to be lived with others in community that see all of life and they see all of your life in turn.
Heath Hollensbe:Yep.
Heath Hollensbe:So you had just mentioned a moment ago getting into some of your story, and one of the things I appreciate is, oh boy, you're down.
Heath Hollensbe:Yeah.
Heath Hollensbe:You're down the trail a little bit.
Heath Hollensbe:You've, you've been in this lifestyle for quite a while.
Heath Hollensbe:How did this start out for you and Tina?
Heath Hollensbe:Uh, were you guys discipled in this way, like a lifestyle of dec of apprenticeship or is it something you just discovered?
Caesar Kalinowski:Well eventually, but well long before I sold a ton of books on this topic or helped plant churches and apprentice thousands of people into this lifestyle of mission and discipleship in like a dozen countries, my family and friends, we were all trying to figure this out too.
Caesar Kalinowski:Just like everybody.
Caesar Kalinowski:And I started hearing this term that described the life of Jesus in his disciples.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, those first ones and those who live like missionaries today.
Caesar Kalinowski:And there's this term was Missional.
Caesar Kalinowski:Now we've probably all heard that everybody listens.
Caesar Kalinowski:Probably heard Missional.
Caesar Kalinowski:Okay.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:But that, I remember back when I was hearing this, I was like, oh my gosh.
Caesar Kalinowski:Like people live like missionaries, you know?
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's how Jesus lived.
Caesar Kalinowski:And it carried with a, this idea that our lives should be radically oriented around the same mission that Jesus was on, and in turn he sent his disciples to replicate, you know, making disciples to make disciples.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yep.
Caesar Kalinowski:As a family of missionaries together.
Caesar Kalinowski:So my wife and I, Uh, Tina and I, we decided that we were gonna begin to gather up some of our closest Christian friends to eat meals and discuss what it would look like for us to start living like as a Missional Community.
Caesar Kalinowski:We heard that term we're gonna do this, right?
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, start to try to treat each other like family, like really inviting those that God would hopefully call us to Disciple, to also hang out with us and walk more closely with Jesus.
Caesar Kalinowski:Sounds good, right?
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Our, our friends thought so too until, okay, yep.
Caesar Kalinowski:Until things progressed to where we were gonna actually move beyond a weekly meal.
Caesar Kalinowski:And just talking about it, you know, talking about being Missional to actually going out and building new relationships, and that takes time.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yep.
Caesar Kalinowski:And serving those in need in our city and actually going to make the disciples.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right.
Caesar Kalinowski:And that's when everybody recoiled a bit.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, I started hearing like, oh man, that's, that all sounds good.
Caesar Kalinowski:See?
Caesar Kalinowski:But that means my schedule's gonna like, Really have to flex for that.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, and I'm too busy, you know, or like maybe in the winter after all this, you know, soccer and school programming and stuff, maybe we'll see then, you know, or whatever.
Caesar Kalinowski:Mm-hmm.
Caesar Kalinowski:And that's kinda when it all fell apart and we pretty quickly, unfortunately, we pretty quickly ended up disbanding our little, you know, band of brothers and sisters, so to speak.
Caesar Kalinowski:Oh man.
Caesar Kalinowski:And kind of discouraged.
Caesar Kalinowski:We decided, I guess this Missional thing just doesn't work here in the suburbs.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, we lived in the suburbs of Chicago, but Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, they just doesn't work where you live.
Caesar Kalinowski:Now there's good news though.
Caesar Kalinowski:Okay.
Caesar Kalinowski:The story didn't end there.
Caesar Kalinowski:It did for a moment.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, it did for a season, right?
Caesar Kalinowski:But I've learned a lot since then, and that's probably why we're talking about this today.
Caesar Kalinowski:And we, we've now like God's grace man, like lived a really rich experience of our faith in community with friends and neighbors for years and, and guess what?
Caesar Kalinowski:So do our now grown kids.
Caesar Kalinowski:They love God.
Caesar Kalinowski:They love people really well, and like have an open table and it's, and they do this right?
Caesar Kalinowski:And it turns out that trying to jam a bunch of, you know, quote Missional stuff into our schedules wasn't really the answer.
Caesar Kalinowski:And, and what we discovered was that like we, we kind of landed on this unique combination of like kind of innovative teachings that kind of tweaked a bunch of ideas, like I said, how to unlearn, learn some stuff, you know?
Caesar Kalinowski:Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:Um, some heart transformation that had to take place and then like immersive training experiences where people like kind of do life together Yep.
Caesar Kalinowski:Um, in real time.
Caesar Kalinowski:And, and that creates what I, you know, referred to early as like an integrated lifestyle apprenticeship.
Caesar Kalinowski:Wow.
Caesar Kalinowski:And you know what, by the way, that's pretty much what Jesus did with his folks.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:So, um, and, and let me just say this right now.
Caesar Kalinowski:You, you're not gonna wanna miss our next episode because I'm gonna tell you the kinda the rest of that story and what we learned and how we started to change everything starting with ourselves.
Caesar Kalinowski:But everybody just keep listening here today.
Caesar Kalinowski:I'm not done.
Caesar Kalinowski:I'm gonna tell you, you know, more about.
Caesar Kalinowski:How this type of apprenticeship works and how you can maybe even get engaged in something like that with me real soon.
Caesar Kalinowski:So anyway,
Heath Hollensbe:yeah.
Heath Hollensbe:So I can actually speak into that from a real life experience.
Heath Hollensbe:The, the way that I fell in love with this concept, like when you said you hear the term Missional and you were gonna put your band of brothers together.
Heath Hollensbe:It happened for me after hearing, uh, it was you speaking at a conference and, uh, oh man, you spoke with, actually you spoke with Hugh Halter.
Heath Hollensbe:Uh, Jeff Vanderstelt was there and it was, uh, a bunch of different churches coming together trying to figure out what this.
Heath Hollensbe:Gospel and community and mission look like and the the biggest question was that we were all so excited cuz it's such an a normal way of living.
Heath Hollensbe:We got back and we're like, okay, where do we start?
Heath Hollensbe:And we all had different viewpoints on where to start and we couldn't figure out a happy like foundation to start living this way out together.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:So, and I, I get that email or question every day.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's like pretty much, Hey, this sounds
Caesar Kalinowski:great,
Heath Hollensbe:but where Yeah.
Heath Hollensbe:And especially if you're trying to work it out with people who do have schedules that are busy, but we promised at the beginning to tell people how they could get started living, uh, this lifestyle discipleship, um, themselves.
Heath Hollensbe:And so my question is, What would be your answer to those who want a square one first thing to do to get this sort of thing going?
Caesar Kalinowski:Hmm.
Caesar Kalinowski:Well, Heath, like I said, you know, the average Christian is looking to move their faith from just a weekly event.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yep.
Caesar Kalinowski:To a more daily, vibrant experience of, you know, their faith in the rhythms of everyday life and, First off, you have to want that.
Caesar Kalinowski:Hmm.
Caesar Kalinowski:Like if you don't, you know, you're probably just turn the podcast off now.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know?
Caesar Kalinowski:Because some people don't.
Caesar Kalinowski:People would you say
Heath Hollensbe:also they need to be willing to sacrifice to get that right?
Heath Hollensbe:Because I know a lot of people
Caesar Kalinowski:that want that, but they just don't.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:But I'll be honest with you, like, like everything, that's God's grace and it's beautiful.
Caesar Kalinowski:Like you might think you're sacrificing until you actually do, and then God blesses the heck how you are.
Caesar Kalinowski:Like that was no sacrifice.
Caesar Kalinowski:Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's like you lose your life to gain it kind of thing, right?
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:So, so like I said, most people are already, I think, are looking for this.
Caesar Kalinowski:I don't know too many people when you talk about would you like to have a, a vibrant faith that touches all of life, not just like when you're sitting in the pew and getting your mind blown by a killer sermon.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Like, nope, I'm just happy with that.
Caesar Kalinowski:There are those folks though, and probably not even listening cause they wouldn't have found us and stuck on this, but, but what they haven't though found is a way to break.
Caesar Kalinowski:Out of that Christian cycle of like, you know, American life or whatever you're listening from.
Caesar Kalinowski:I know people listen to all over will but like this Christian cycle of really busy of you know, in life and work.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, and kids and all and then you just kind of a little bit of Sunday church or maybe a weekly small group jammed in when it fits.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right.
Caesar Kalinowski:And most people though, they might want it.
Caesar Kalinowski:They don't like you said.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:I don't know how to break the cycle though, cuz I still got home from that conference and.
Caesar Kalinowski:I was busy as heck.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:And everybody had a different opinion.
Caesar Kalinowski:A little bit of the blind leading the blind.
Caesar Kalinowski:Right?
Caesar Kalinowski:Yep.
Caesar Kalinowski:And so what I find is they end up kind of doing the same things year after year, but hoping for a miracle.
Caesar Kalinowski:Hmm.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, hoping for something to magically change, but it doesn't.
Caesar Kalinowski:So, you know, you read another book on Missional or you, you know, you hear Sure.
Caesar Kalinowski:A podcast, you know?
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:Or you, you know, something else and you just, but it, right.
Caesar Kalinowski:So, Yeah, that,
Heath Hollensbe:yeah, I, I agree with what
Caesar Kalinowski:you're saying.
Caesar Kalinowski:So let me give you, let me give you this week's big three as a way of giving everyone the takeaways, like that starting point.
Heath Hollensbe:Okay, cool.
Heath Hollensbe:So the big three is something that we do in each episode.
Heath Hollensbe:These are things that you, uh, you're gonna want to know and believe things you can get started with right away.
Heath Hollensbe:In light of today's discussion
Caesar Kalinowski:and every week, you can also get a printable PDF of the week's Big three as a free download.
Caesar Kalinowski:We always do that by going to everyday Disciple dot com slash big three b i g three, before I give you those though.
Caesar Kalinowski:I wanted to tell y'all that in just a few weeks, we're opening up only 12 spots to begin working with a limited group of dedicated Disciple makers who are gonna join us in our everyday Disciple makers coaching experience.
Caesar Kalinowski:With our everyday Disciple framework, you'll find clarity on what discipleship really is, what it looks like, and how to Disciple others to maturity.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's all the stuff we've been talking about today.
Caesar Kalinowski:We'll teach you exactly what to do and how to do it with the confidence to keep moving forward at a sustainable pace, something that fits your life we'll help you find a work ministry family life balance while making discipleship part of your normal life.
Caesar Kalinowski:If you feel like your current Disciple making process or lack thereof is not producing transformation, freedom and maturity in your people, our proven discipleship framework will help you change that.
Caesar Kalinowski:We've helped thousands of people in every imaginable context and age and stage of life do that, and like we said, they're finding greater spiritual freedom as they are released from a discipleship model.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's sort of week to week and based on behavioral modification and sin management, they're seeing the relationships healed that have been broken sometimes for years and years.
Caesar Kalinowski:And all of this flows from gaining a deeper understanding of the Gospel in all of life and then growing in our gospel fluency, the ability to see and speak and experience the good news in every part of our lives and relationships with others.
Caesar Kalinowski:If you wanna get more information on exactly how this coaching works, maybe you're just kind of wondering.
Caesar Kalinowski:Scratching your head.
Caesar Kalinowski:I'm thinking about this.
Caesar Kalinowski:You talk about it pretty often.
Caesar Kalinowski:You wanna find out more if and see if it's a good fit for you.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, let's just do that.
Caesar Kalinowski:Let's just talk.
Caesar Kalinowski:Go to everyday Disciple dot com slash coaching to set up a discovery call.
Caesar Kalinowski:You and I will hop on, get to know each other, find out a little bit about your current discipleship process, and see if we can help you accomplish your Disciple making goals, either as a family or for your entire church.
Caesar Kalinowski:So just go to everyday Disciple dot com slash coaching and let's get this ball rolling.
Caesar Kalinowski:Now, Heath, back to the big three.
Caesar Kalinowski:Caesar Big three for this week.
Caesar Kalinowski:Okay.
Caesar Kalinowski:And there again, this is, this big three will serve as like, here's where I think it starts.
Caesar Kalinowski:Like you're trying to live a lifestyle this, you know, like what do we do, right?
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:So anyway, big three head, heart, hands.
Caesar Kalinowski:Discipleship is meant to be an all of life activity.
Caesar Kalinowski:A lifestyle.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah.
Caesar Kalinowski:I hope you know that we've said that enough today that people start to believe that it's all in.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah, it's all in.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's not a series of classes.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's not like I turn it on, I turn it off like I'm doing discipleship.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's a lifestyle.
Caesar Kalinowski:Um, and without intentional effort to both be discipled and to live with and then Disciple others, there is no way to really make mature disciples that look more and more like Jesus.
Caesar Kalinowski:Remember.
Caesar Kalinowski:Man, I told you GC and M like Gospel centered in community and out on mission together.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's great.
Caesar Kalinowski:So I hope people will, will know that.
Caesar Kalinowski:Okay.
Caesar Kalinowski:Now second of the big three, believe that the discipleship model that Jesus practiced with his disciples is the same one he calls us to today.
Caesar Kalinowski:I.
Caesar Kalinowski:He didn't say, Hey, I did it this way and I taught them to do it this way.
Caesar Kalinowski:And I sent them out to do exactly what I told 'em to do and modeled.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah, but you'll just make up something else.
Caesar Kalinowski:Maybe sit in rows, take some notes.
Caesar Kalinowski:You know, it's like he, he sent 'em out to do it.
Caesar Kalinowski:Life on life, life in community and life on mission.
Caesar Kalinowski:Hmm.
Caesar Kalinowski:And, and remember this, Jesus was a carpenter and he was far more likely to think of his disciples as apprentices.
Caesar Kalinowski:Not as students.
Caesar Kalinowski:Yeah, it's good.
Caesar Kalinowski:Like I'm gonna get a bunch of knowledge in your heads, guys.
Caesar Kalinowski:No.
Caesar Kalinowski:Their apprentices, what's apprentice do.
Caesar Kalinowski:That's why I call it a lifestyle apprenticeship.
Heath Hollensbe:They learn the skill from there.
Heath Hollensbe:The one who know better, watch, they try,
Caesar Kalinowski:they suck, they learn, they ask questions, hands on.
Caesar Kalinowski:Exactly right.
Caesar Kalinowski:And then the third of the big three.
Caesar Kalinowski:Stop hoping for a miracle to happen and change things.
Caesar Kalinowski:Without some new intentionality in your life, you won't all of a sudden somehow magically produce mature disciples and children who grow up to love the Lord and live a healthy Missional lifestyle.
Caesar Kalinowski:It's not gonna just magically happen.
Caesar Kalinowski:Hm.
Caesar Kalinowski:Um, get the training you need.
Caesar Kalinowski:Invest in your life and in the lives of your children and your friends and your neighbors.
Caesar Kalinowski:Alrighty.
Caesar Kalinowski:And remember, if you wanna learn more about the coaching that we offer, how it works, and see if it's a good fit for you, go to everyday Disciple dot com slash coaching.
Caesar Kalinowski:Let's set up a discovery call.
Caesar Kalinowski:There's no obligation or anything, just want to talk to you, get to know you a little bit, find out about your current Disciple making process, see what's going on, see if we can help you move things forward, either for you and your family, or if you're leading a church or a bunch of small groups, or whatever it be.
Caesar Kalinowski:Missional communities.
Caesar Kalinowski:Just go to everyday Disciple dot com slash coaching and we'll get you started.
Caesar Kalinowski:All right?
Caesar Kalinowski:Or at least see if it's a good fit.
Caesar Kalinowski:Okay?
Caesar Kalinowski:I sure hope you'll do that, and I sure hope you'll join us again next week.
Caesar Kalinowski:We'll tell you what we've learned about how to jumpstart or restart your Missional communities or small group.
Caesar Kalinowski:It'll all naturally flow out of today's talk as sort of a part two, and you won't wanna miss it, and I'll talk to you soon.
Heath Hollensbe:Thanks for joining us today.
Heath Hollensbe:For more information on this show and to get loads of free discipleship resources, visit everyday Disciple dot com and remember, you really can live with the spiritual freedom and relational peace that Jesus promised every day.